eruthros: Martha Jones smiling! (DW - Martha Jones is awesome)
[personal profile] eruthros
I had this idea last night and I just have to share:


River: she kills a good man, the best man she's ever known.

River doesn't kill the Doctor, of course - he isn't the best man she's ever known.

She kills Rory.

Like, the whole point of this episode is that the Doctor isn't a good man (he has to have rules) - the title isn't about him, really, it's about Rory going to war. So. Rory: he's a good man. (He's not a warrior, he's a nurse.)

And now that he's her dad, who her mom told her stories about when she was just a baby, who's always going to look for her, it's easier to image him as the best man she's ever known. Plus her reaction to Rory at the beginning of the episode in the Centurion outfit, which strongly implies that he's dead already in her timeline. Plus it just feels right. Plus it's that kind of misdirection Stephen Moffat seems to like, where we're told told the truth and it leads to the wrong conclusion.

Also I keep forgetting to get or make Amy and River and Eleven icons, which is sad.

Date: 2011-06-05 02:39 pm (UTC)
monanotlisa: alex and maggie next to each other (aaamy! - dw)
From: [personal profile] monanotlisa
I would say, Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!, what with the Doctor-killing buildup...but hmm, this:

her reaction to Rory at the beginning of the episode in the Centurion outfit, which strongly implies that he's dead already in her timeline.

Rings very true.

Date: 2011-06-05 03:09 pm (UTC)
monanotlisa: amelia pond dragging the Doctor by his tie. WORDS CANNOT EXPRESS MY LOVE! (eleventy!11!!! - doctor who)
From: [personal profile] monanotlisa
(Also, I guess there is no law against River killing both her father and the Doctor, with good reasons each time, of course -- doubly whammies are in fact a bit of a specialty of the Moff, see the latest ep.)

Date: 2011-06-05 03:31 pm (UTC)
monanotlisa: (adventures! - dw)
From: [personal profile] monanotlisa
Somewhat shockingly, I know exactly what you mean...

Date: 2011-06-05 02:50 pm (UTC)
arch: Eleven, Amy, and Rory in front of the TARDIS (doctor who - 11/Amy/Rory/Tardis OT4)
From: [personal profile] arch
This makes so much sense, although it gives me ALL THE SADS.

Date: 2011-06-05 03:04 pm (UTC)
aria: ([doctor who] river fucking song)
From: [personal profile] aria
I find this very likely!

MOFFAT, STOP KILLING RORY. :(

Date: 2011-06-05 03:08 pm (UTC)
trouble: Sketch of Hermoine from Harry Potter with "Bookworms will rule the world (after we finish the background reading)" on it (Default)
From: [personal profile] trouble
Oh gosh, yes. I was speculating back a few weeks ago that the season break was going to involve a maybe "Dead for real" Rory, (or at least dead for a few episodes, again) because of all the "They Keep Killing Rory" going on, but I think you're right.

(That was my first thought. "Oh gosh, River's seen Rory die." Later on I thought "Oh, this is the first time she's seen him this young in her timeline" after the reveal of him being her father." But yes, I think you're right about her killing him.)

Well. It's good to know the fic I started last night is going to be Jossed come Autumn. I better get that finished.

Date: 2011-06-05 03:32 pm (UTC)
trouble: Sketch of Hermoine from Harry Potter with "Bookworms will rule the world (after we finish the background reading)" on it (Default)
From: [personal profile] trouble
I'm not! I just need to finish it by the end of August and then post it and then everyone will love it because it is all about River Song and her adventures in Grad School and then I will get cookies from people when it is Jossed pretty much immediately.

:D She goes on adventures across space & time.

Date: 2011-06-05 03:18 pm (UTC)
anatsuno: the ninth doctor, seen from behind as he opens the doors to a normal blue police box (sometimes a box is just a box)
From: [personal profile] anatsuno
This makes so much sense :( :( :(

Date: 2011-06-05 03:40 pm (UTC)
catecumen: (spinning)
From: [personal profile] catecumen
I like this, and it does make sense to me, especially with her reaction this time. What's your theory about River's not-very-escape-proof prison? Although she keeps coming back, nobody seems to be trying all that hard to keep her from escaping again, which suggests that she's actually expected to escape and knows that and plays along. What do you think that's all about?

Date: 2011-06-05 03:50 pm (UTC)
rheanna: pebbles (Default)
From: [personal profile] rheanna
Ooooh, brilliant theory. Moffat does love misdirection, and we're obviously *meant* to think River kills the Doctor.

Date: 2011-06-05 04:09 pm (UTC)
pocketmouse: Centurion Rory, looking determined (rory)
From: [personal profile] pocketmouse
Ever since River said she'd killed a good man, I've been waffling back and forth on whether it's Rory or the Doctor or someone else. I finally decided it wasn't Rory because she didn't recognize him in The Pandorica Opens, and if she'd killed him she'd recognize him, but then I realized only about a week ago that of course, that was still part of the timeline where Rory never existed, so that could be why she didn't recognize him.

Still, there's a good part of me that doesn't think Doctor Who would ever get away with endorsing patricide, and also I'm still rather suspicious of the fact that while River is supposedly in jail for killing this man, she doesn't seem at all remorseful -- swanning in and out of prison to go have adventures doesn't sound like what you'd expect from someone who truly thought that the person was actually a great man. So I'm basically biting my lip and trying to hold off on speculating too much, and writing as much fic as I can before I'll probably have to apply personal retcon to the series finale.

Date: 2011-06-05 04:25 pm (UTC)
anatsuno: the ninth doctor, seen from behind as he opens the doors to a normal blue police box (sometimes a box is just a box)
From: [personal profile] anatsuno
but you can be guilty of killing a good man without being "guilty" of it, if you know what I mean - think, er, Dumbledore's death for example. She could have been the cause of that death in many different ways that would leave her distraught but not like, make her a terrible killer-type *feels inarticulates, hope you see what I mean*

Date: 2011-06-05 04:29 pm (UTC)
pocketmouse: Rory and the Doctor looking at each other. Rory is suspicious, the Doctor is smiling (rory11)
From: [personal profile] pocketmouse
I get what you mean, but I think if she had killed Rory or the Doctor, I feel like she'd be more demonstrably remoseful in a way that precludes going ice skating on her birthday. If it appears that she's killed Rory or the Doctor and she's got to spend time in Stormcage to preserve the timeline, that I could buy.

Date: 2011-06-05 05:02 pm (UTC)
such_heights: amy and rory looking at a pile of post (who: rory [60s drag])
From: [personal profile] such_heights
Yeah, I like this idea. We know she's in prison because she's keeping a promise to someone, so this would fit.

And and also time can be rewritten and everything's going to be FINE in the end. Which is the kind of thing I need to say to myself periodically when discussing the fate of the Ponds. They'll be FINE.

Date: 2011-06-05 05:13 pm (UTC)
pocketmouse: Amy and Rory Pond (ponds)
From: [personal profile] pocketmouse
Of course the Ponds will be fine! Fanfic said so!

Date: 2011-06-06 02:20 am (UTC)
ironed_orchid: pin up girl reading kant (Default)
From: [personal profile] ironed_orchid
The Good Man in the title makes sense, and oh, the opening scenes with Rory where fantastic...

(here via [personal profile] trouble)
Edited (typo) Date: 2011-06-06 02:21 am (UTC)

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eruthros: Delenn from Babylon 5 with a startled expression and the text "omg!" (Default)
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